M14 Talk

M1A-ScoutThis is a continuation of a discussion started on the OT yesterday where Grunt was showing off a new/old toy: an M14-derivative, M1A-Scout from Springfield Armory.

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About GruntOfMonteCristo

Fearless and Devout Catholic Christian First, Loving Husband and Father Second, Pissed-Off Patriot Third, Rocket Engineer Dork Last.
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35 Responses to M14 Talk

  1. Solaratov remarks:
    Excellent choice!!! You are, indeed, well-armed. For the scope mount, go Sadlak. The Airborne STEEL mount. (NOT aluminum). They’re expensive as hell – but worth it. And, you’ll be getting other parts from Sadlak, anyway…to inprove it a bit.

    Check this out……
    http://wethearmed.com/rifles/m14-m1a-rifles/

    Grunt:
    Thanks, Sol. Great WeTheArmed article about the M1 history. In addition to all that, I like the fact that this rifle is truly field-maintainable. My jaw dropped the first time I saw a gunsmith pull the thing apart in about 3 seconds. And there were no tiny needle-like pins and parts you need to keep in your mouth so they don’t get lost in the sand while you’re trying to put it back together.

  2. Sol, thanks also for the Sadlak tip. I am still undecided on what type of sight configuration(s) to use, given the obstacle of the top ejection. Also, there’s the complication that this is a dual-mission rifle that can be used for medium range and long range shooting. It’s a tough problem to solve.

    Barn, I know you’re an M1 Garand & M14 junkie. I appreciate your input as well. Or anyone else. Thanks!

    • solaratov says:

      Since you’ve got that forward rail, a *good* red dot sight would get you through most of what you want it for. Two top ones that won’t break the bank are the Lucid HD-7 Gen.3 and the Aimpoint PRO (patrol rifle optic). The PRO will run under $450 (Brownells, Midway) and the Lucid is a bit less (GunMojo – forum sponsor @ WTA sometimes has group buys for about250). My choice would be the PRO – simply because of the 2-minute dot…but either one will be great.
      You can get the scope mount, rings and scope later on when you have *considerably* more to spend. The 18″ barrel on that will allow you to make shots at a lot longer range than you think; so a really good scope can be justified. Depending, of course, on how your particular rifle shoots. You should be able to make decent 800 yard shots with that gun and good ammo (if you aren’t too old to see that far, of course. πŸ˜‰ )

      You have ordered your Slipstream, haven’t you?

      III

      • solaratov says:

        PS…
        Pick your magazines carefully. Try to stick with US ISSUE magazines or order from Checkmate Industries (20 & 25 round mags. that work – parkerized) I believe that cheaper than dirt has 20-rd. military mags still in the wrapper at a decent price.

        • Yeah, easy for YOU to say, Mizzou-boy. Here in Colorado, we’re stuck with an epic magazine ban that just got reaffirmed by our genius state Democrats, so 10 rounds is it for us. πŸ‘Ώ For now, anyway.

        • solaratov says:

          “I am still undecided on what type of sight configuration(s) to use, given the obstacle of the top ejection.”

          That’s what those mounts are made for. I used one for a few years on my M-14 – and *NEVER* had the scope interfere with ejection. The problems come when one tries to use a “bridge-type” scope mount that isn’t designed specifically for the 14.

          III

          • When you say you had a scope on your M14, are you talking about a mount on the left using those side-hooks? Or the top? My Scout front rail is really short and off-standard, of course, but I’m assuming your sniper-version had some kind of rail on top? Is that what you used? Was it a short scope that was completely clear of the ejection port, or did it overhang the port some?

            Sorry for all the questions. I’ll try to find a photo of a VN-era M-14 sniper version and put it up to help with this.

            Ok, here’s the M21 with side-mount scope, right?

            Ok, I think I get this. I had assumed the scope mounted asymmetrically to clear the ejection port, but apparently it’s just the mount that’s on the left, and the scope, itself is fairly close to center-line. And you say this doesn’t interfere with ejection at all? And the spent brass ricocheting off the scope doesn’t knock it off zero?

            • solaratov says:

              The bottom pic is closest to what I had. (Mine had been “worked over” specifically for my rifle by the armorer) As I recall, it also seemed to sit a bit higher than that, too – but it was a long time ago.

              III

            • solaratov says:

              I’m assuming your sniper-version had some kind of rail on top? Is that what you used? Was it a short scope that was completely clear of the ejection port, or did it overhang the port some?

              Nope. No rails. (We’re talkin’ *early* 60s, here. Nobody had even heard of rails on guns.
              The scope mount attached on the left, took a 90degree turn from the vertical and sat over the top of the receiver. The spent brass didn’t hit the mount (or, if it did, it never affected the scope or mount).

              Stop worrying. Thousands of people have used these mounts and had no ill effects from them. It’s not going to bend your scope.

              III

      • Good stuff, Sol. Thanks! Slipstream on the way! πŸ™‚

        I actually agonized over the 22″ vs. the 18″ barrel, but the gunsmith I talked to pushed hard for the 18″ and was able to quote shoot-out results that showed very comparable results at 800 yds. Good to know you’ve seen the same thing. That extra 4″ of barrel can really get in the way if it’s not that important.

  3. Knight4GFC says:

    How’s the accuracy downrange? What is it’s reach?

    • According to the article Sol linked at the top, a non-match-quality rifle like this can be expected to hit man-sized groups at 800 yds. The gunsmith I spoke to, who worked on these a lot and did a lot of long range shooting claimed that with the heavier ammo, maybe 180gr, these will consistently hit silhouettes at 1000 yds. Maybe not 1 MOA accuracy, but close. I suspect for that kind of shooting you’d need some work on the riffle, like some special bedding, a better stock, and like Sol says, expensive optics.

  4. barnslayer says:

    Trying not to be a downer but mine looks like the one with the walnut stock (minus the scope/mount). The metal has that just right greenish color to the parkerizing. It tears me up to have to decide between breaking this new law and selling it. I can’t bring myself to have it neutered.

    • Don’t ruin it. There’s got to be a way to have it stored out of state. Are there services like that available? Or maybe you can “sell” it to a friend out of state with the understanding that they will keep it in their safe, temporarily as their own, giving you a deposit that would be returned after the stupid law is revoked. Is that possible?

      • barnslayer says:

        I dunno “friend”. Your Scout looking for a playmate? Honestly, I can’t see that working out regardless who it is.
        To answer your question above regarding optics. I am way past being a junkie. I would never put glass on an M1 unless it was an M1C or D and then it would have to be period issue. I guess I don’t have any first hand suggestions for the M1A.
        For your new rifle…. you need to shoot it with the iron sights first. You may not even want a scope. If you do, I’d go long range keeping with the sniper history. Leupold tactical ($$$$$ warning) fit the profile.

        • Thanks for the optics tips, and I’ll definitely be shooting this weekend with the iron sights. You may be right about that. I might give up on glass.

          About the storage question. I really was not suggesting me, since my safe is far too small for that kind of thing. Plus, I’d assume you’d want a pretty big deposit for you to be comfortable letting go of your “kids,” however temporarily. My wife would not be keen on that arrangement, anyway. “You just gave him $3000 for the privilege of keeping his guns in your safe for him? I don’t think so.” But if you had a really good friend somewhere, it might work. There would need to be some alcohol involved, I’m sure.

          • barnslayer says:

            Definitely alcohol would be required but I don’t think it would feel right no matter how much I drank.
            I was only kidding Grunt. BTW you guys are my really good friends. Anyone closer would be right here in the same predicament as me.
            As I said before, I’ll give you guys first crack (if you want) if I sell.

            My M1A sat nice and still while being fired. In anticipation of having to sell it I got a Saiga .308. Supposedly very reliable but has all the charm of a vinyl saddle.

  5. solaratov says:

    Download this pdf…

    PDF]
    FM 23-8 ( U.S. Rifle 7.62mm, M14 and M14E2 ) 1965
    Also, don’t worry too much about the bedding right now. There are other things that you’ll want to do first. Remember: your *first* consideration is reliability. As long as you can get pretty much in the center mass of an E-target at 250-300 yards, you’re good to go. But the bullet-launcher has got to go bang every time you pull the trigger (assuming, of course, that in your dotage you haven’t forgotten to load the beast. πŸ˜‰ ).

    III

    • The dotage thing is a possibility. I’m not that old yet, but the dementia seems well advanced. πŸ˜‰

      I don’t think your pdf link came through, but it reminds me that Springfield Armory sent me a copy of the Army Tech Manual for the M14 in the box with my brand new toy. The actual yellow-covered, staple-bound document. I was flipping through the manual on the night of my birthday after buying it, and I noticed the date on the cover: January 1963. That manual was issued as my Mom was getting ready to go into labor, and you guys were shooting at the VC in SE Asia. Made my day.

      • solaratov says:

        We’ve all done that…get lined up for the most perfect shot of your life, gun steady as a rock, perfectly regulated breathing and heartbeat, perfect trigger squeeze…..CLICK!
        (Of course, it’s always better if you’re doing that in a match or practice, rather than when someone’s shooting at you.)
        And I know what you mean about the dementia thing. Though, to be PC about it, I suppose we should refer to them as our “Senior Moments”. πŸ˜‰

        • I’m guessing you had the first part of my response, about leaving the safety on and holster gremlins, up on your screen all day while you were out shooting ground hogs. ‘Cause I deleted that part of the comment about 7 hours ago and added the part about the PDF link not working. Otherwise, I don’t know how you’d know about the safety comment unless you have friggin’ telepathy or something. I didn’t even think I actually posted it. I thought I just typed it and backspaced over it. Damn, either this is a twilight zone moment or my dementia has gotten worse than I thought! 😯

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